tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2513019539869706574.post6697968589278491799..comments2024-03-29T20:04:30.755+08:00Comments on Monsters and Manuals: How I Run Sandboxes in the City, Part III: Appendix NUnknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger13125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2513019539869706574.post-2412923827252786832012-02-13T06:46:01.645+08:002012-02-13T06:46:01.645+08:00Try the book "Gangs of New York", which ...Try the book "Gangs of New York", which the movie was based on. 19th century gangs fighting with knives and half-bricks, venturing out on the rivers to make pirate raids on nearby towns, etc.<br /><br />The same author wrote similar books about the underworlds of San Francisco, New Orleans, and Chicago.Jon Hendrynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2513019539869706574.post-45341761947391115522012-02-12T06:58:46.488+08:002012-02-12T06:58:46.488+08:00Sure - that's what I was describing in these p...Sure - that's what I was describing in these posts, I think...<br /><br />But after a while you get critical mass, where because the players know lots of NPCs they find "stuff happening" simply as a result of that.<br /><br />I'm not sure if that makes sense - it's late.noismshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09933436762608669966noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2513019539869706574.post-26374082094549854682012-02-12T06:24:13.298+08:002012-02-12T06:24:13.298+08:00I feel like for a sandbox city unless your list of...I feel like for a sandbox city unless your list of NPCs is prohibitively big, it's going to feel too clannish and more like an university or something than the city. which isn't to say you don't want some cast of known NPCs, but that the city-ness comes out of an event that's not part of their web and it's like "this thing happened, and NPCs involved with it almost seemed to form out of the ether"<br /><br />Does that make any sense?Colehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09873430636366896071noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2513019539869706574.post-16544969814712693112012-02-12T06:16:02.595+08:002012-02-12T06:16:02.595+08:00Zak and Cole: The thing I'm trying to get at w...<b>Zak</b> and <b>Cole</b>: The thing I'm trying to get at with this series of posts is almost that if you have a big list of NPCs all living in one city who actually interact with each other and the players in vaguely realistic ways, then by definition something will always be happening, every day. After a while the game is coming to the players as much as they are coming to the game.noismshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09933436762608669966noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2513019539869706574.post-86375129718602964252012-02-12T06:03:19.246+08:002012-02-12T06:03:19.246+08:00not because of the NPCs per se, but because events...<i>not because of the NPCs per se, but because events emerge in an interesting way</i><br /><br />That's what I'm getting at. I feel like with a city to get the city-ness, that comes not from a fixed knowable cast of NPCs but from the <i>something is always happening, every day</i>Colehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09873430636366896071noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2513019539869706574.post-37933498658844100372012-02-12T00:56:03.590+08:002012-02-12T00:56:03.590+08:00Viriconium is good for me as a city sandbox thing ...Viriconium is good for me as a city sandbox thing not because of the NPCs per se, but because events emerge in an interesting way. And the names are good.<br /><br />And it's perfect.<br /><br />Though it would take some translation to turn Viriconium events into Cybercity events.<br /><br />There's always Nova Swing for that, however..Zak Sabbathhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08812410680077034917noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2513019539869706574.post-40747863793273928612012-02-11T16:02:02.535+08:002012-02-11T16:02:02.535+08:00Welcome to Dungeon!: I love the Viriconium books, ...<b>Welcome to Dungeon!</b>: I love the Viriconium books, but I always thought they set out to do the opposite of what I mean: they postulate a cityscape that is totally unknowable and ungameable. Rather than having a Big List of NPCs, they have four recurring archetypes. And they reveal only glimpses of the geography, history and culture, so that you're never quite sure what's going on. That's deliberate and it's what makes them the masterpieces of fantasy literature that they are... But I don't think they're very useful to read if you want inspiration for a city sandbox game.<br /><br /><b>Gavin</b>: Don't get me wrong, I love Shogun. But I don't think I'm alone in saying that it ends far too abruptly. In the last 50 pages it's as if Cavell got bored and went, "Okay, and they all lived happily ever after, the end." Noble House takes it to another level in terms of plotting.noismshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09933436762608669966noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2513019539869706574.post-24286284872193002322012-02-11T15:29:45.625+08:002012-02-11T15:29:45.625+08:00Thanks for the Noble House recommendation! I read ...Thanks for the Noble House recommendation! I read Shogun last year and loved it, and had been wondering if any of his other novels were anywhere near of the same standard. Funny that Shogun is by far the most famous.Gavin Normanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12362875699031245377noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2513019539869706574.post-76264357075439033122012-02-11T07:10:53.653+08:002012-02-11T07:10:53.653+08:00And yeah, thirding HomiciceAnd yeah, thirding HomiciceWelcome to Dungeon!https://www.blogger.com/profile/14346914156633328775noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2513019539869706574.post-86597604938067154652012-02-11T07:10:12.211+08:002012-02-11T07:10:12.211+08:00How about Ellroy? Especially The Big Nowhere and W...How about Ellroy? Especially <i>The Big Nowhere</i> and <i>White Jazz</i> for the thick and tangle and weird of all the things happening and overlapping in city-time.<br /><br />Surprised not to see In Viriconium and Viriconium Knights there.Welcome to Dungeon!https://www.blogger.com/profile/14346914156633328775noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2513019539869706574.post-7649999036624264042012-02-11T07:03:20.784+08:002012-02-11T07:03:20.784+08:00Brendan: If you like The Wire and haven't read...<b>Brendan</b>: If you like The Wire and haven't read Homicide, do so at once. <br /><br />At the end of the first chapter you'll be finding it hard to follow and wondering what all the fuss is about. Half way through you'll be finding it impossible to put down. By the end it will be one of your top 10 favourite books.noismshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09933436762608669966noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2513019539869706574.post-38919891897061507162012-02-11T03:22:24.249+08:002012-02-11T03:22:24.249+08:00The Wire: best TV show I have ever seen. Just have...The Wire: best TV show I have ever seen. Just have to give a shout-out there.Necropraxishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12716340801054739658noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2513019539869706574.post-40916505640028866692012-02-11T00:55:15.507+08:002012-02-11T00:55:15.507+08:00I'm seconding Homicide right now.
Another nic...I'm seconding Homicide right now.<br /><br />Another nice thing about it is that you get to find out how much of the stuff in The Wire was totally true.Zak Sabbathhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08812410680077034917noreply@blogger.com