What defines a 'bad' monster? For me, it generally has at least one of these three qualities. First, it shatters verisimilitude by being either 'jokey' or just really hard to visualise or imagine. Second, it has some nuclear-grade special ability that can only really be avoided or circumvented by a successful saving throw rather than player intelligence. Third, it is just boring, usually because it is too much like a lot of other monsters, or because it has no obvious role beyond being a benevolent quest-dispenser or GMPC.
These qualities we can call, for shorthand, silliness, unfairness, and boringness.
On this basis, I would say that the Worst Five MonstersTM in the 2nd edition Monstrous Manual are:
5. Banshee. I am not averse to the concept of this monster in principle, as the concept of a banshee as it exists in folklore is deeply eerie and evocative. And actually the Monstrous Manual entry is nicely written and provides some good ideas for use of a banshee in a campaign region. But the monster itself is high in boringness (its role overlaps too much with that of the ghost or spectre) and unfairness (it gets to just show up, scream, and then everybody might die).
4. Cloaker. The picture in the Monstrous Manual does this monster no favours, but it is intrinsically very high in silliness, both through shattering verisimilitude (try picturing a flying cloak with glowing red eyes attacking somebody in your mind's eye and tell me it doesn't immediately transform into a scene from a cartoon) and for having no obvious justification for its existence other than surprising adventurers. And then you have the fact that for some reason it can emit magical 'moans' of different intensities. Now try imagining that: a moaning, flying cloak with a face in the middle.
3. Faerie Dragon. I just think that the last thing that any D&D campaign needs is a creature which 'thrives on pranks, mischief and practical jokes'. Practical jokes are visual, for one thing, and are not funny when being verbally described, but the more important issue is that joke monsters are like campaign cul-de-sacs. A random encounter with something which simply intends to 'wreak mischief on passers-by' provides no adventure hooks, nor danger, but simply acts as a distraction or speed-bump. The faerie dragon is therefore both silly AND boring.
2. Ki-rin. There are too many of this kind of monster in the Monstrous Manual, and they all bleed into one: couatls, lammasu, shedu, sphinxes...all of the same: flying benevolent sky dwellers who descend to the the world below to smite evil and help out the PCs (presumably on the basis of their taking part in some pre-ordained quest or mission). I am fully on board with the idea that there should be powerful good entities in the world if there are to be powerful evil ones, and that enterprising players should on discovery of their existence seek them out for aid, but there is too much of a duplication of roles her and too much of a stink of 'plot' about the ki-rin in particular. The boringness is off the charts.
1. Sea Lion. Just stop it.
Let me be a heretic on this one:
ReplyDeleteSpectres. They run faster than you do. They fly faster than your horse gallops. They do nothing except drain TWO levels from you every time one touches you (with NO saving throw). And they are usually encountered in groups. And with an I.Q. of between 130 and 140, they will target clerics so as not to get turned by them.
If spectres surprise your party, you are toast. You can't even run away. They are nothing but fast-flying, double-level-draining machines.
Good call.
DeleteEh. Sometimes a game needs some asshole monsters that everyone is afraid of for a reason.
DeleteWas going to say. It's not all cricket.
DeleteI hate monsters that have a fear-inducing ability like coffer corpses or giant shrews. You mean to tell me that these goobers will make you flee in terror but facing down a red dragon won't?
ReplyDeleteYes, unless it is explicitly billed as a magical ability, but I take the point that having a mechanic define a PC's emotional response to anything should be a no-no.
DeleteMagical fear gas would be a good breath weapon - perhaps on a smaller, flightless dragon that creates panic among its enemies then finishes off anyone who didn't flee with claw/bite attacks.
DeleteWhy don't you like sea lions?
ReplyDeleteAs opposed to all those serious D&D monsters like the Bullette, the Roper, Gelatinous Cubes, Beholders, Rust Monsters, Trappers, etc. Lol
ReplyDeleteThis sort of thing always amuses me. It's the same as touting the 'realism' of a game with magic spells and floating castles. I really don't see these critters as any different from dozens upon dozens of others.
It's a fun and silly game full of fun and silly beasties.
Good point I'd say!
DeleteThere are legitimate grounds for discrimination. You don't agree with noisms' criteria but you must admit he's right to have some.
DeleteAnd a fun and silly blog post.
DeleteOf course everyone can have their most and least favorites.
DeletePersonally it's hard for me to separate the Cloaker from the Trapper, the Lurker Above, the Mimic, the Staircase That Punches You in the Nuts...what? That last one isn't a D&D monster? I could've sworn it was. It fits perfectly.
I think theres a difference. Those are cartoony but more samurai jack than scooby doo if you see what Im saying. Except trappers are really silly.
DeleteImagine this guy's D&D though.
Delete"You open the door. Beyond is a room, no different from dozens and dozens of others. As before, this room contains critters. Each is no different from dozens and dozens of others."
"I react as before."
"Okay, roll."
"I rolled a dice."
"The result is the same as dozens of others."
"This is fun and silly."
"Yes."
Exactly. Orcs, wyverns, cloakers, dragons, duergar, sea lions. ALL EQUALLY SILLY.
DeleteIt's difficult to find a copy of, but check Tsui Hark's "Zu: Warriors from the Magic Mountain" to envision an evil cloak monster that is evocative and creepy. (In truth that movie is an endless font of inspiration for an Oriental Adventures campaign.)
ReplyDeleteYou can find the Chinese version here (just be sure to turn on the Close Captioning for the English translation): https://archive.org/details/zuwarriorsfromthemagicmountain1983
DeleteNice.
Delete5. Banshee. A banshee CAN scream, if it's night, but will it? It's a restless yet tethered soul, how might one placate it so it doesn't voice its deadly wail? Ghosts are perfect puzzle monsters.
ReplyDelete4. Cloaker. I once put one in a wizard tower so that, if things fell that way, the wizard could put it on a PC to act much like that one beastie the laughing magician set on Cugel, meanwhile employing its shadow powers on their behalf. No such bargain was struck, the wizard is dead, but I'd do it again.
3. Faerie Dragon. I can't think of a devil's advocate argument for a faerie dragon, I'm sorry.
2. Ki-rin. Better than shedu or lammasu and the Trampier art is solid. I like a powerful creature of good that is deer or horse like and liable to gallop away on air any second, they should not overstay their welcome. "Females are never encountered" inspired for me a chaotic and evil female opposite who never makes contact except to mate, with the expected infanticide of males as potential for ki-rin adventure hooks.
1. Sea Lion. Despite the many things one could say against them they're not the worst chimera I've seen, and the DCS art is pleasingly heraldic.
You did your best. The peoblem with the Sea Lion is mostly just that all it is going to do is elicit groans from the PCs for the bad pun. Immersion ruined.
DeleteSingapore thinks Sea Lions are so cool they made it their official mascot.
DeleteI don't know if it was updated to 2e, but the worst monster from AD&D is the magnesium spirit in the Fiend Folio. It is undead draining on steroids. What purpose does it have other than screwing the characters over?
ReplyDeleteWhich also brings up green slime. Unlike the various oozes, AD&D and 2e rules for it are horrific.
Yeah, green slime is nasty, but the rules are also really unclear as to how you're supposed to get rid of it.
DeleteHow are they unclear? Scrape it off (and discard the scraper) or burn it (and its host) before 1d4 rounds (random roll) or byebye.
DeleteSee? You just resolved the ambiguities, but they are there.
DeleteI will defend cloakers, when I ran A2 the players were baffled and terrified by the cloaker. So based on that I will say that they work better in actual play than you might think.
ReplyDeleteFair enough. They just make me think of the scene in Naked Gun 2 1/2 where Leslie Nielsen gets a towel to the face.
DeleteI think there are extremely solid grounds for a host of LG/goody creatures. I don't like Ki-Rin either... but I do like morally bizarre PCs attempting to rob/con/ruin/slay heaven... with any number of motivations for doing so.
ReplyDeleteBring forth the guardians of the gate!
Yes, not against the idea in principle, but against the blandness and sameyness of the actual examples.
DeleteI think that's a fair observation. One has to read around the myths on which the monsters are based to get a good feel for them.
DeleteI think the Fairie Dragon was a cool picture looking for substance. What they should have done is make them like flying piranha. You get dazzled by the butterfly wings and then before you know it they are shredding your henchmen.
ReplyDeleteAgreed. It is a cool picture.
DeleteAlso kirin are technically giraffes, which makes it hard for me to take them seriously.
ReplyDeleteThe first-ever issue of "Dungeon" I bought had an adventure where a faerie dragon had been kidnapped by a tribe of tasloi, who were using its euphoria breath weapon as a drug. The adventurers were drawn into things when a young kid in the woods told them about his missing friend. That was a pretty interesting concept, I thought (and I reused the tasloi cave map about a million times over the years).
ReplyDeleteThat was mine also! Weird!
DeleteFor both trickster and quest-giver types the challenge is the same. They have to be written as doing something that actually challenges the party in social interaction. The basic monster description does not have to have that, but GMs are greatly helped by examples either in the monster book or some kind of "book of lairs" supplement.
ReplyDeleteFor example, the leprechaun's abilities to use ventriloquism, illusion and actually polymorph any object can make for great pranks. Imagine a trio of leprechauns sneaking up on a fighter, whose helmet, sword, and shield suddenly sprout faces and start complaining and agitating for higher "pay" - which of course, needs to be thrown down an old well for some reason or other.